Here’s a question: when do you abbreviate brief forms within words?
For example, “all.” All is O (fallen over…hehe…can’t you just picture it screaming “OOOOOOO!!” as it falls? Sesamie Street anyone?) instead of AL. You see this in also (OSO), almost (OMO), and always (OLS). But you know it isn’t used O the time (hehe…couldn’t resist…I can never resist can I?) Like in allot (ALOT), allude (ALUD), almond (AMND??), alms (AMS??) (Where’d the L go, Rader? I guess a guy that wrote 30,000 words (in just that one dictionary) can be allowed a little leniancy, but he missed it often in the “al-” section…but it isn’t a prefix!)
Anyways, what’s the rule for things like this? Along is “ALNg” but that makes sense because the long, LNg, brief form takes precedence…and speaking of THAT! Is there any rule of precedence with brief forms when they share a phonetic sound like AL and LAwNg?
./[tyler]
(by psetus
for everyone)
for everyone)
Yes, there is a rule (surely, you would expect that, ). The syllable "ul" is expressed as u-hook, while the syllable "al" is expressed by the o-hook, only when it is pronounced "aw-l". The words "also", "almost", "altogether", "always" are all written with the o-hook because they are pronounced aw-l. Now, how about the word "aloud"? Since the "a" sound not the "aw" sound, we use the "a" circle. When is the "l" omitted? We omit the l when the "al" is pronounced "awl", or when there is another consonant after the l. So "alms" is written "ams", "almond" as "a-m-nd". In those cases, the "l" is hardly pronounced and that's why it is not written. Quiz: how do you write "salmon"?
You crack me up, Tyler. Glad I could be of help.
The a in "alms" and "almond" is not "aw". Instead, it is the "a" from "far" and "father" — that's why it is expressed as a circle and not as o-hook.
Ok…I can see the slight difference in the pronounciation, thanks for that. But like you said "We omit the l when the "al" is pronounced "awl", or when there is another consonant after the l." So almond and alms starts with "AwL"…why aren't they OMNd and OMS? I thought at first it had to do with the division of syllables, ie you insert the brief form only when the brief form will replace a complete syllable(s)…but that's not true as almond is AwL' – mund. Let me try this (I'll look in the dictionary after I try it out) SAMN? Now to look it up…Oh NO! Oh YES! Ha! Now people who wonder will never know if I was right or not…go look it up yourself! Thanks for the tips, Chuck! ./[tyler]
Hmmm…that could just be the "regional differences" that Gregg doesn't have that you were just typing about. My dictionary agrees with you…but when I pronounce them according to the pronounciation key, they sound the same. I don't say all "awl;" I say it somewhere between but much closer to the A in "father." Awl sounds too southern to my throat box (Throat box. Mmmm : ) Maybe before taking up Gregg, everyone should first go through their dictionary and memorize the IPA of every word…sorry Ray…at least you won't be needing your Simplified manual for awhile, just incase it gets delivered late! Better get cracking! He he : ) Just kidding. (You only need to memorize the 20,000 most common words.) ./[tyler]
I just have to put in my $0.02 on this topic. (Where the hell is the "cent" symbol on a computer? And don't tell me to use the c and overstrike it with a /." Some words are written in shorthand as they are for the purposes of transcription ease, i.e., to avoid confusion with another word or to avoid hesitation in transcription. Marc
The 짖 sign is typed by holding the alt key (left preferably…just cause it's cool), typing 0162 into the keypad on the right (doesn't work with the numbers above the keyboard), and releasing alt. No no…before you console yourself with "oh my…what a geek…he knows how to type in the cent sign…I'm so much cooler than him!" I don't know it by heart…just go into the character map (accessories, system tools, charmap), find the symbol you want, and on the bottom right it'll tell you the keystroke when you select it. So you see…I'm still soooo cool!…now I'm off to watch Pride and Prejudice, slice up some strawberries and kiwi, and draw a bath! I'm a man's man, and not ashamed…don't be jealous! : ) ./[tyler]
I'm with 'ya, Tyler. In elementary school, I only learned three sounds for each vowel: cat, car, care. There was no "caw". I'm hoping that I'll do alright not learning the "aw" sound. For now, I'm just trying to memorize the different spellings. If that doesn't work, I guess I'll have to check out that International Phonetic Alphabet, though I don't think it should be necessary. See also Identical Vowels. _________________ Shorthand: isn't it about time?
Aw is written as a rotated c in the IPA. It is the sound made before the r in ordinal. It is the au in Santa Claus. It is produced as a rounded uh sound. It is most heavily heard in the Midwest and in England, as the Southerners in the US tend to change it from a pure vowel to a diphthong, "ah-oo." It really is a distinct sound.