“Downstairs” – the word – how would you write it?

Hi everyone!
Today I found in my bookshelves a Gregg Shorthand Dictionary – Diamond Jubilee Series; Copyright 1963 (in seemingly near perfect condition).  I thought I had other Shorthand books that I’ve kept around, but must have sold them somewhere along the line.  I picked up this dictionary at a used book sale years ago. 
Anyway…  I have been thumbing through the pages, refreshing my memory and trying to decide if Diamond Jubilee is in fact style of Shorthand that I was taught 25 years ago.
I came upon the word, “Downstairs” (page 85).  Well, first I came upon “Down” and I thought to myself that I would have just done a “D-N” combination, but the dictionary actually spelled out “D-AH-OO-N”  (if memory serves me correctly, I believe those are the sounds for the characters).  Ok, so I thought I was wrong, I must have somewhere along the line forgot to add the “AH” and “OO” and jumped the gun and just did the “D-N” character.  Then I thought about how I’d write “downstairs” and I would have wanted to just write “D-N-ST-R-S”.  (wish I could show you what I wrote)  But the dictionary pretty much spelled it all out as “D-AH-OO-N-ST-A-R-S”. 
Do these differences suggest to anyone what version of Shorthand I know?  (or knew…lol)
Thank you in advance,
Crissy 

(by crissy—- for everyone)

30 comments Add yours
  1. Hi Chuck,   Not sure I understand your first sentence.  You first stated, "No series of Gregg shorthand expresses "down" with the dn blend.", then you stated, "it's either the characters d-n for Simplified and before, or…", etc.    Hmmm……..Is the "D-N" blend never used or used in Simplified & before??    Without referring to my DJS dictionary, I am apt to say the word "during" would be written "D-R-(dot) ING".  However using the information I received about "down" and "downstairs", I am wondering now if it's actually written "D-U-R-(dot)ING".    Thank you for your help and replies.     Crissy    

  2. No series of Gregg shorthand expresses "down" with the dn blend: it's either the characters d-n for Simplified and before, or d – a – u – n for DJS or later.

    But, maybe I could help. Do you remember how would you write the word "during"?

  3. Not a problem, let me try to help. What I meant was that the word "down" was written either as (1) d – n as two separate letters, or (2) d – a – u – n (4 letters). The blend existed in Simplified and before, but it wasn't used for "down": it meant "do not" after pronouns.

    Ok, let's try two other words: assume, doctor.

  4. Hi Chuck,   Ah ha…I see.  "D-N" means Do Not, not down in Symplified…wow, I'm either rustier than I though or completely confusedt!  Thanks for clarifying that.    For your question, I'll try the easy one first because I ran into this yesterday while scanning through my DJS dictionary…"Doctor".  I was tempted to spell it "D-R", but again, they spelled it out.    "Assume" is a little tougher because I haven't ran across that one in the dictionary nor given that word any thought in 25+ years.  I can see the "A-S" ….and if I were writing right this instant, I'd just put the "M" after that, but with all this DJS stuff (I'm thinking maybe it's not in my best interest to look through that dictionary anymore) I'm tempted to say "A-S-OO-M".  But to spell it out like that doesn't feel natural to me.    Like I mentioned previously, I took these classes around 1979.  Do you think the Los Angeles School system used shorthand originating from 1949 in the 70's when there was an upgraded version available?  Perhaps new books were cost prohibitive or the teacher available only knew Simplified.    I've looked through the sites available here to see if I recognize any of the books, but alas I do not.  Most likely because we were required to put covers on all our books.    Crissy

  5. That's interesting.  I was using "dr" for both doctor and during.  Certainly they do spell out doctor in DJ.  However, I see in looking at the lists for the brief forms that it represents "during" as a brief form for Diamond Jubilee but "doctor" as the brief form for Series 90.  So I guess I will continue to use them interchangably and rely on the context of the sentence to sort them out.   Tom

  6. Hi Crissy   Welcome.   How do you write work?   Simplified = r-k DJS = oo-k S90 = r-k   I'm not sure about Centennial, or anything earlier than Simplified.  I've adapted to the Simplified or, with the o turned on it's side, but I just cannot get used to the r-k for work. It just looks wrong.   Frankly, I think it's likely you learned DJS — they may not have wanted to buy new texts for a dying course. By 1979 it was a six year old corpse at my high school.

  7. Tom,

    The "dr" form is used to write both doctor and during. I think the context gives it well away. 🙂

    If you want, you can employ lots of great abbreviations like those seen in the Anniversary book. Knowing them does not conflict terribly one's learnings from the later systems. 🙂 There are some very handy ones like k-t for country, a-b-v for above, and r-k-d for record. Check them out. They are available not only at my site http://gregg.angelfishy.net/ but from the Files section of this group. 🙂

  8. This is fun — it is like solving a puzzle.

    If you learned DJS, you would write
    doctor as "d – o – k – t – r"
    assume as "a – s – m"
    during as "d – r".

    If you learned S90, you would write
    doctor as "d – r"
    assume as "a – s – u – m"
    during as "d – u – r – ing".

    The S90 books first came out in 1978. I don't have any high school DJS books that I could scan the cover, except for an old HS DJS transcription book from the 60s. I'm inclined to say that you may have learned S90 (with some remnants of DJS), but the closeness of the release of the S90 books with your high school years gives me some doubts.

  9. Hi Sid,   Work…that's a toss up for me.  Initially, my gut feeling said OO-K.    Gosh, I don't know what to think as far as which version I originally learned.  As soon as I think Diamond Jubilee, then something makes me wonder if it was Simplified.  Do you think since I have the basics, I can just choose one version and concentrate on re-learning it?  Are they that different?    Crissy  

  10. The general consensus as far as I can tell is that that is what you should do. Pick a version and stick with it.   They are not that different ultimately — it seems that we can usually read most of the stuff written in other versions, but learning seems to work better if you stick with one until you learn it.   Good luck.

  11. Diamond was the only book to not use rk for work. Dn seems perfectly okay to abbreviate down. The older dictionaries seem to have included more abbreviations and brief forms as entries and as parts of words. The later dictionaries spelled out most words even though the manual presented them as brief forms or abbreviations. In situations where rapid writing is attempted, I find myself writing out a word for which I have actually studied the brief form or abbreviation. But Gregg is wonderfully accomodating that way, isn't it!   DOC

  12. taaliba2 I learned DJS but then wanted to learn the older version (not realizing it was called Anniversary).  I could only get up to 120 wpm (with lots of errors) in DJS and wanted to write faster and had read in the book where some had back them with Anniv.  I think DJS is prettier then Anniv., though.  And easy to learn.  Or easier, I should say. Debbi

  13. Wow Chuck….that  looks so familliar!  That's a workbook though, right?  I just tried to look that up in eBay now (Gregg Shorthand Workbook) and got one seller.    Thanks for posting that….I feel as if I'm getting closer to discovering what version I know/knew.   Crissy

  14. Chuck,  Thanks so much for the marvelous sample of German Gregg you so graciuosly provided. It seems to be a letter from a German businessman to an associate  in which he requests a loan to pay a debt to a  company with which his firm does a huge amount  of business. From this fine sample I am already able to identify word forms, abbreviations, possible brief forms and phrases. As  you have pointed out Gregg is indeed cursive. What has caused me to wonder and research is the fact that most European longhand is rigid and vertical. Because curvrlinear letter formation  is not their natural hand movement, perhaps this explains why Gregg did not enjoy the degree of success as with English and Latin American Spanish (in some countries south of the border they actually declared a workfree Gregg Holiday!).Again in examining German, French and Italian native shorthand systems, they seem to have freely borrowed from each other a non-geometric, rounder rather than curved, linear style that employs some shading and very little positioning.What is also interesting is how Gregg adapted his system to sounds not common to English. From Polish Gregg I want to determine how Gregg handled the problem that every word is inflected and can come anywhere in the sentence. So again, thank you Chuck! If anyone in the group has an available German Gregg Manual, I'll give you a good price!        DOC

  15. >And what about Simplified? I just learned that ow before an N in a word is omitted, so would it be d-n-s-t-a-r-s?   I've just checked my Simplified dictionary. That's exactly how it's spelt.   Kevin

  16. Hi marc 🙂 I'm also someone who's been learning Simplified for a while and am thinking about DJS since I'm getting to the brunt of where the rules in Simplified start coming hard and fast (mostly the tons of rules of omission) which I must learn anyway to progress through the manual. I'm still comparing the two as much as I can (though I've not found any information about the average speed difference between DJS and Simplified, or about affixes) and it didn't even occur to me to use parts of them both.

    What things from both systems are you using? I'm thinking I'd use some brief forms that I don't know why were cut from DJS, like "all", "let", "any", "got"… and maybe not being so omission-happy in words as Simplified seems to be, but I'd like to see what you've done 🙂

    -Erik (since MSN decided to make me submit personal information that its own Privacy Statement said it would use for soliciting, so I got a junk address instead to use)

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