Live vs leave

They’re both nouns. I’ve been reading philosophy, and some sentences make sense with either. The Simplified dictionary writes them both Lev.

Does another version do them differently? If so, I’ll use that.

Thanks!

 


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    1. Thanks! I keep forgetting about those, even though they're on a stickie on the first page of my dictionary, including the rarer curved one.

  1. Live and leave are usually verbs, so I think that’s what Cricket meant? In any case, the only way to distinguish them from one another that I can think of (other than context) is the tick mark indicating long-E.

    There is no official mark to indicate the short-I sound (a dot indicates short-E). Incidentally, I have often wished that there was a third diacritic for vowels like short-I, short-A and Short U because the absence of the mark can essentially mean any vowel since there is no way to know if it is intentionally left out or not.

      1. That curve diacritic does not apply here since a vowel differentiation mark already exists that covers that case, the vertical dash for the long sound of e as in "leave", as Derek pointed out in the first comment and Aaron also. The short sound heard in "live" does not have a mark. Unfortunately, the second edition of the Simplified manual removed all diacritics, but they still appear in the first edition of the Simplified manual.

        Quick way to remember: long sounds use a dash, middle sounds use a dot, and short sounds use no mark.

        The little curve is used only if there are no other ways of differentiating vowels: it's an option of last resort and it is seldom used.

        1. I was responding to Aaron's remark "There is no official mark to indicate the short-I sound (a dot indicates short-E). Incidentally, I have often wished that there was a third diacritic for vowels like short-I, short-A and Short U because the absence of the mark can essentially mean any vowel since there is no way to know if it is intentionally left out or not."

      2. Thanks, Niten.  I had never seen or heard of that mark before and if I understand it correctly, that would solve this seldom occurring but sometimes important problem.

        Carlos:  Just so I'm clear, the curve diacritic could be used to indicate the short I in the word LIVE as in Cricket's example, yes?

        1. No, not in the live example because there is no other word with short i or e sound that has the same exact outline. Dr. Gregg explains it clearly in The Q's and A's of Shorthand Theory (comments in brackets by me):

          "The distinction [of using the dot to distiguish between short i and e] could be made in that way in 999 cases out of a thousand; but if you had occasion to take down a letter or speech in which the words emigrate, emigration [which would be written with a dot, but you forgot to write it], occurred over and over again, and then suddenly the words immigrate, immigration, occurred, you would realize the necessity for distinction—and there would be no time to go back and place the dot under the words emigrate, emigration, previously used. Hence the necessity for having a positive method of distinction in such an emergency. Similarly, if you were writing about “election returns,” being familiar with the wordsign for return you would write the form without thinking of putting a dot underneath to mark the short e sound. Then suddenly the word writs might occur and you would realize the need for distinction—and the little curve would come in handy. It is an emergency expedient [emphasis mine]—very rarely needed, which explains why it is not given in the early stages of the work."

          The only other case I've seen the little curve (the "breve" mark) for the short vowel notation is if you need to make a distinction in proper names, when you need to make sure you capture the correct spelling and pronunciation (like writing the vowel next to the name, for example). But if by context you already know the word, you don't really need it.

          As I always say, you can write outlines any way you want in your own writing, though the intention of the mark is clearly as an emergency expedient in the middle of a dictation, like the emergency exit in an airplane in case of a problem. You could probably use it if you’re writing the word “leave” and, all of the sudden, in the middle of dictation, the work “live” (with short i) comes in, and by context, you cannot figure out if it’s “leave” or “live.” If the breve would have been important enough, it would have been kept as a principle. Is it nice that there is an alternative for those rare occasions? Yes. Would I use it all the time? No.

          I hope this helps.

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